Edited

Rep. John Murtha appeared on Hardball this evening and made an obscene claim, he said that our Marines “killed civilians” in Iraq.

Are you calling Murtha a liar, Ian?

It has been documented by the national and international media, as well as eye-witnesses including soldiers.

Murtha was discussing a soon to be released Pentagon report that shows that the killing of the 15 civillians in Haditha in November of 2005 was deliberate and worse than initially reported.

Republican Tim Russert said his sources in the pentagon have told him that Murtha is right and is speaking for the troops.

Murtha is a fucking jackass. Typcial Democrat who loves undermining the US Military for cheap political gain.

If he the same Murtha that writes for the Fluffington post?

Liberals rooting AGAINST America! That is disgrace!

Murtha is a fucking jackass. Typcial Democrat who loves undermining the US Military for cheap political gain.

Typical idiotic conservative response.

Our soldiers deliberately kill 15 women and children and you’re calling Murtha a jackass? I guess you feel those soldiers had every right to murder innocent children?

I’m amazed at how low conservatives will go to support this war and the administration.

If he the same Murtha that writes for the Fluffington post?

Liberals rooting AGAINST America! That is disgrace!

How is this rooting against America? The troops deliberately killed 15 innocent women and children. The disgrace is sick people like you who see nothing wrong with this.

Thou shall not kill – unless they’re a different religion than us – the conservative mantra.

Before coming to any conclusions, you should really read the Flopping Aces post. He brings up an important thing that you may not be aware, that Murtha should be.

[...] Say it ain’t so Congressman Murtha.  From Expose the Left (who else watches MSNBC?) with Congressman Murtha on ‘Hardball.’ CHRIS MATTHEWS, HOST: Let me ask you Mr. Murtha to give us some details about that. Draw us a picture of what happened at Haditha. [...]

How do you liberals know they were “innocent?” They strap BOMBS to their kids…they use them as human shields.

You liberals never give up

WOW.

This is really sad. Our soldiers are over in Iraq to bring freedom and democracy, as well as win their hearts and minds, and instead they’re gunning down innocent women and children.

What is even sadder is the response by conservatives who see the soldiers as heroes, and Americans who despise their deplorable actions as traitors.

The best part is that the libs have tried and convicted our own soldiers of murder without any evidence or testimony, aside from the word of a senile old man who used to be a patriot.

Libs NEVER give our troops the benefit of a doubt; remember when some troops shot an Iraqi who was pretending to be dead inside a mosque? The libs went nuts, but the soldiers were found to be innocent of any wrongdoing. What about the case of Lt. Pantano? The libs were all over him, too, and the charges against him were dropped.

The libs will not hesitate to stomp all over our nation and our troops in their neverending jihad against Bush. They don’t hate America; they just hate Bush and Republicans to the point where they would destroy America just to ‘get’ Bush.

Chris from Victoria, BC on May 17, 2006 at 11:15 pm said:

Before coming to any conclusions, you should really read the Flopping Aces post. He brings up an important thing that you may not be aware, that Murtha should be.

Murtha is refering to a soon to be released Pentagon report and NBC has also spoken with Pentagon officials who confirm this.

How do you liberals know they were “innocent?” They strap BOMBS to their kids…they use them as human shields.

You liberals never give up

WOW.

You conservative never give up.

It’s already been confirmed by numerous news sources and you’re implying the victims may have been terrorists.

This will be a huge black-eye for the US and it’s Armed Forces. And instead of being outraged by the actions of a small group of soldiers, conservative are again trying to portray anyone who sees this as a deplorable incident as someone who hates America.

Sorry, guys. It’s not going to work this time.

JWL on May 17, 2006 at 11:25 pm said:

The best part is that the libs have tried and convicted our own soldiers of murder without any evidence or testimony, aside from the word of a senile old man who used to be a patriot.

Libs NEVER give our troops the benefit of a doubt; remember when some troops shot an Iraqi who was pretending to be dead inside a mosque? The libs went nuts, but the soldiers were found to be innocent of any wrongdoing. What about the case of Lt. Pantano? The libs were all over him, too, and the charges against him were dropped.

The libs will not hesitate to stomp all over our nation and our troops in their neverending jihad against Bush. They don’t hate America; they just hate Bush and Republicans to the point where they would destroy America just to ‘get’ Bush.

JWL - Murtha is talking about the findings of a Pentagon report. Officials have already confirmed that the report will show that US soldiers killed innocent civillians in cold blood. And military officials have also said that Murtha is right.

But when the Pentagon report does come out and proves Murtha is right, you conservatives will have a hard time spinning this and looking for someone else to smear.

#3 Frank: Why do I see a lot of liberals saying Tim Russert is a Republican here and there around the internet? You do know he worked for Mario Cuomo and Daniel Patrick Moynihan before working at NBC News, right? Perhaps you have some new information that he’s now a registered Republican, but I seriously doubt it. If they’re not insanely liberal, red-faced and frothing like Murtha, then they must be Republican, eh?

Newsflash: A pending investigation does not equal conviction.

Godless, treasonous, seditious liberals: beware. We’re approaching a boiling point.

“Murtha is refering to a soon to be released Pentagon report and NBC has also spoken with Pentagon officials who confirm this.”

Sure, just like the ‘Bush is eavesdropping on millions of Americans’ story was confirmed numerous news sources.

Why do libs refuse to give our troops the benefit of a doubt? If they are found guilty, I will condemn them. NOT before.

I’m not ready to condemn our soldiers on John Murtha’s word. Don’t be so eager to assume the worst of our soldiers!

If it is true (and even if it isn’t), watch the left’s venerated representatives and their hate-gorged websites attempt to show an isolated incident (that may or may not be true at all) as widespread, just as they did with Gitmo (liked to the Soviet Gulag) and Abu Ghraib.

If Murtha said it, it has to be true. There is nothing that makes Republican Apologists pee their pants more than being confronted with the truth. Just remember. In wars “bad things” happen. What do you expect? Our guys making nice after being targets day after day, week after week, year after year? This is an old story. Murtha is repeating it, not telling it.

...but they support our troops.

“JWL - Murtha is talking about the findings of a Pentagon report. Officials have already confirmed that the report will show that US soldiers killed innocent civillians in cold blood. And military officials have also said that Murtha is right.”

So you say. But do you have any proof?

“But when the Pentagon report does come out and proves Murtha is right, you conservatives will have a hard time spinning this and looking for someone else to smear.”

If Murtha is actually right for once, and the troops did murder the Iraqis, I will condemn them. Perhaps you’ll be happy then? No, you won’t be happy unless I say that Bush is somehow responsible for their actions.

Here you go, here’s a bit of evidence which contradicts Murtha:

http://www.armytimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-1808360.php

“Rep. John Murtha, an influential Pennsylvania lawmaker and outspoken critic of the war in Iraq, said today Marines had “killed innocent civilians in cold blood” after allegedly responding to a roadside bomb ambush that killed a Marine during a patrol in Haditha, Iraq, Nov. 19.

The incident is still under investigation by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service and Multi-National Forces Iraq.”

Your turn.

Amazing how fast you liberal trolls are willing to believe the worst about out fighting men.

Do you know any soldiers? Ever been in the service? Didn’t think so.

Murtha is a disgrace and a traitor.

Murtha has more credibility on both sides of the aisle than every member of the White House put together. That still isn’t saying much.

Remember Americans are too squeamish to see the blasted apart bodies laying all over the place on their televisions. The pictures of what “really” happens in wars are too “real” for average Americans. It is too hard for people to associate “spreading freedom” with a line of dead bodies covered in blood soaked sheets.

If you really want to make a point, pile 100,000 dead bodies on a Republican’s lawn. Maybe they would get it.

Their death is 100% our fault. Invading a country without the proper authorization, allies, planning, logistics, security capability. There is no way all the mistakes our leaders have made in Iraq have been an accident.

The wanted Chaos. There is no other answer.

There is no way anyone could make as many strategic mistakes as the Bush sleazebags by accident. Telling 500,000 Iraqi troops to go home, and take your weapons with you, against the advice of every member of the State Dept. What’s up with that?

Bottom line, it is being investigated and if the facts confirm what the congressman has publicly disclosed, punishments will be administered. Strikes me though, the congressman needs some help with stress management. This is a non-combatant situation, and he does no look or act like he has his faculties well in hand.

Hey Fugazi us “realists” understand the pressure our boys are operating under. What happened here has been documented. Our guys will make mistakes. Look at the pressure they are operating under. Why do you thing over half of the soldiers returning are having problems dealing with what they have had to deal with. Going out on patrol after patrol wondering if today is the day they get blown to bits.

It is not about trashing the troops, for they did not expect to be used as tools for Bush’s power grab. They joined up to defend America, not make more enemies for America. I have a few friends either in the military, or just out, and every single one to the man says how we invaded Iraq was a mistake. Taking out Saddam was not necessarily a bad thing, but how we did it without a plan to rebuild the country immediately was a huge mistake. Those are not my words, they are their words. We screwed up big time.

“Murtha has more credibility on both sides of the aisle than every member of the White House put together. That still isn’t saying much.”

So senile old men have the most credibility of all, in your view? How is Murtha somehow more credible than anyone else, including other veterans? Of course it’s because you believe him and his stupidity in calling our troops guilty of murder before the investigation is completed.

There they go “Supporting the Troops Again”.

Even if the worst is true these would represent the tiniest fraction of a percent as compared with the entirety of the US Military.

But of course logic and reason have never stopped the Dems before… why should it now?

JWL on May 18, 2006 at 12:06 am said:

“Murtha has more credibility on both sides of the aisle than every member of the White House put together. That still isn’t saying much.”

So senile old men have the most credibility of all, in your view? How is Murtha somehow more credible than anyone else, including other veterans? Of course it’s because you believe him and his stupidity in calling our troops guilty of murder before the investigation is completed.

JWL, you’re missing the first nugget of Dan’s reasoning:

“If Murtha said it, it has to be true.”

Charitably, I will call him an idiot.

If Murtha had shown the same outrage for bomb-wielding children exploited, or innocent contractors hung after being murdered, he may have more credit as being objective. He didn’t. Therefore he has no credit. End of Story. Thanks to the “Always Faithful” that “Guard Heaven’s Gates”

Murtha was in the military… now he’s a traitor..
those other former generals, they were in the military… now they’re traitors…

How many other traitors-to-be are there I wonder…

So you say. But do you have any proof?

Proof? LOL.

C’mon JWL, you know as well as I do that when it’s something that might make our troops look bad (or worse), truth is the first casualty with these little Birkenstock-wearin’ bitches.

Hard to figure how these (unprincipled scumbag) libs suddenly ‘warmed up to’ Murtha even though he voted YES on authorizing the President to use the United States Armed Forces against Iraq though.

Who’d of thunk it?

Even if the worst is true these would represent the tiniest fraction of a percent as compared with the entirety of the US Military. -venmax

Not to mention, as with the genital-mocker, our military would be the ones prosecuting (if this turns out to be true) the crime. But no, they’ll bash the military, pretend it’s more than it is (if it is at all), and wonder why anyone would DARE question their super-patriotism.

I’m ashamed to say I live in the state that Murtha represents. I’m going to have to do some research to find out if his seat is up in 2008 (which I bet it is), so time for us in the Keystone State to get busy and drum him out.

And was it Plamegate when Matthews had his breakdown? I used to watch him regularly, and just can’t do it anymore, he’s so far off the wall. Or is it MSNBC management, Joe Scarborough is talkin’ American Idol rather that congressional matters, they leave that to Keith, the sportscaster.

Thank goodness CNN’s Headline News now has a decent program with Glenn Beck!

this is the most inane argument about the war that goes on between the left and the right. here is how it actually is when we shovel all the left/right swagger aside:

1) all armies commit war crimes and crimes against humanity, usually at the behest of only a few individuals (even in the very worst armies).
2) to point this out is not anti-american or even anti-war, it just is.
3) part of adulthood, you will soon learn, is taking responsibility for one’s actions, which means those small few individuals in our army who’ve done wrong deserve to be reamed for what they’ve done; they simply are a disgrace to the flag (which they were carrying when they did it).
4) we must support our troops as a whole, whatever our beliefs about the war and the crimes certain individuals committed; these are our people, dying for our country (right or wrong), and it’s perverse and sickening to see people disparage them because they disagree with the war, because the motivations for it have nothing to do with our kids.

now in this case, murtha is referring to a specific report from the pentagon. no new ground is being broken. neither is it being broken when someone accuses the US of war crimes. you can either be naive and suggest they don’t happen, or you can be stupid and say they are justified when they do. these are well-documented in the media around the world. look, it’s a war zone, and you can only condemn ‘shoot first and ask questions later’ to a certain point. but our troops are supposed to be morally better than them (whoever and whereever that may be); as a soldier if that means putting yourself in potential danger instead of killing someone on sight you are doing something pretty heroic. if you see an olive-skinned 15 year old peeking around a corner and drop him ‘just in case’ (against the rules of war and your own ROE) you’re disgraceful. if you execute someone as allegedly occured in this case, you are nothing short of a monster and don’t deserve any of the respect we give our troops as a whole. but ask yourselves a question: do you really think when troops move into an insurgent stronghold and the pentagon reports ‘over 100 terrorists killed’, that everyone that died was a terrorist, or even that all 100 were actually terrorists? you think they wear uniforms or something?

Lemme see.
The report isn’t out yet because the military says the investigation is not done.
But Murtha and the left have declared everyone of the 15 guilty.
We’ve seen this type of “massacre” turn out to be staged. Most recently in a “mosque” where they claimed a bunch of guys were praying when Americans burst in and murdered everyone. Turned out to be bogus..
So why are you on the left so quick to rush to judgement?
Let the report be finished, let it be released and say whatever then.
Most people in this country prefer to let an investigation run its entire course before smearing all 15 people named.
If this goes like past investigations where something bad actually did happen, the chances are most of the 15 will be acquitted, or knocked with something minor like being evasive and a couple will get hard labor for a year and one or two will get the book thrown at them.

That is IF they are found guilty.
One more thing…. the investigation is not yet public so why does Murtha get to leak what he says he knows with his spin on it (which may be right, who can say?).
I don’t think ANYONE is entitled to say anything specific about these guys until the full report is made public…
All you lefties saying it is fact and proven need to quit salivating so hard and be patient.
Then try not to be so gleeful… it makes you look like vultures.

It does make them look like vultures when they are glad of a report of a possible crime on certain death.

fugazi on May 17, 2006 at 11:52 pm said:

Amazing how fast you liberal trolls are willing to believe the worst about out fighting men.

Do you know any soldiers? Ever been in the service? Didn’t think so.

Murtha is a disgrace and a traitor.

Murtha served many years in the Marines. What have you served? You are simply repeating roveian propaganda. Just because we are against the Iraq war doesnt mean we do not support the troops. We blame Bush for this incident. He put our troops in this postition. He let us to an unjustified war. Don’t give me that crap about Saddam being evil. We were shaking his hand while he was killing his people.

Godless liberals? Jesus was liberal get a clue k?

“turn the other cheek”
“love your enemies”
“do good to those that hate you”
“judge not”
“condemn not”

It’s common knowledge that in wars people get killed. Which is why war is bad to begin with. So what if Murtha said that marines killed 15 people? It’s not the first time and won’t be the last. Bush is laughing all the way to the bank. Investigate all the ties the Bush’s and CHeneys have to the defense industry and the oil buisness. They are making tons of cash off the war.

Bush is responsible for every life lost in Iraq. He was the one that didnt listen to the good intelligence he had.

While I am on the subject of insurgent lies and the lefts willingness to believe them, I’d like to ask about the supposed missle attacks and mortaring on helpless civilians that turned out to be militias evening up old scores or plain old random lousy warfighting skills by the Iraqis.
You see it every night on TV… mortar tube bouncing around a couple three feet then they slap a sand bag on it and drop another round down it… geez where’s that one going?
How about the classic guys with RPG’s who run around the corner and fire the thing just sorta up in the air at an angle while hauling ass back behind a wall… oops, gotta land somewhere. Next time you see insurgents on TV shooting, notice that they are usually not aiming and their weapons are almost always angled up. They literally are raining bullets down on people…. but of course all that is our fault.
Not saying our guys don’t miss, but I will say at least they try and are trained to aim in a way that hits the actual target rather than running around a corner and spraying while yelling Allah Akbar (for luck I guess).

Jesus also says He came not to bring peace but a sword… Jesus is depicted as returning in the end with His robe soaked in blood.
Jesus is depicted as the leader of the warrior class of angels.
And Jesus is also all those things you mentioned.

You have to take both. Jesus isn’t always Mr.Rogers with a beard, but He is the most compassionate, kindest being… but when confronting evil against children or the poor and unfortunate, when confronting hypocrisy… Jesus is also fierce and very condemnatory… He draws on some pretty gruesome imagery to illustrate what will happen to the perpetrators.
If you want to play the Jesus card, you have to play the whole thing… not just the part you like.

Keep in mind that at least half the Liberal whackjobs in here were awful damn quick to jump on the Rove being indited BS that Truthout had posted as fact…now theres a solid source huh? You could actually see them salivating at the thought of Rove resigning…but not to be. If our soldiers were guilty of this they will be dealt with, I would asume fairly severely. But I would be very cautious about jumping the gun on this and wait till the facts come out. Its amazing to me how quickly some people are so quick to lay blame on our soldiers. Actually its sad.

Thank you every liberal who has posted here for proving liberals support terrorists and dance when troops die.

Murtha announced on the air that he hopes all our troops die. He is too much of a flaming liberal to say it exactly but he said it by what he said.

REMEMBER A VOTE FOR A DEMOCRAT IS A VOTE FOR BIN LADEN.

15 Marines—Fifteen Marines all broke honor at the same time?

Look, I realize that a word like “honor” has absolutely no meaning to the lefties, some have even told me that outright, but, Damn.

UCMJ, Code of Conduct, add to that the fact that these fifteen marines come from that group of young people whom General Marshall once described as America’s Secret Weapon, “the best darned kids in the world” and Murtha’s charges become incomprehensible. Unless he has a hidden agenda that is uglier than what these kids are being accused of. And he well may. Because he does indeed have that “long military experience” which to me indicates that he knows exactly the methods and tactics he is currently employing. Against his own country.

As upset as I might be at some of the Republicans, the left gives me no other choice at election time, no matter what.

We can all see what kind of justice is to be expected from the left with this one incident here.

Guilty.

Not innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

Just guilty because they say so.

That is called totalitarianism.

.

25dan Said:
11:56 pm [ Quote ]

Murtha has more credibility on both sides of the aisle than every member of the White House put together. That still isn’t saying much.

And your basing that statement on???? Your opinion I would guess and that don’t mean f*ckin squat to me.

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=%5CSpecialReports%5Carchive%5C200601%5CSPE20060113a.html

What Murtha said is true. It is amazing how much trouble “righties” have with dealing with the truth. If you tell the truth they attack you, if it is news they would rather forget. Attack the messenger. Rove has them trained like good little NAZIS!

Good Job Karl I say. Good job.

Attacking the messengers of “reality”. To tell the truth makes you anti american?

You people need help.

Half the problem in Iraq is the fact that the administration refused to tell the truth from the beginning, which means long before the invastion.

You can worship liars. I would rather bring charges.

Dan, do you have any evidence that what Murtha said is true? I have a link which implies that he’s either mistaken or lying:

http://www.armytimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-1808360.php

“Rep. John Murtha, an influential Pennsylvania lawmaker and outspoken critic of the war in Iraq, said today Marines had “killed innocent civilians in cold blood” after allegedly responding to a roadside bomb ambush that killed a Marine during a patrol in Haditha, Iraq, Nov. 19.

The incident is still under investigation by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service and Multi-National Forces Iraq.”

But perhaps you prefer mindless partisanship, Dan.

“You can worship liars. I would rather bring charges.”

Well, I know he’s a liar, but what charges would you bring against Murtha? I don’t think he’s broken any laws.

Dan, do you have any evidence that what Murtha said is true? I have a link which implies that he’s either mistaken or lying

And like the Army Times isn’t biased. And that article is a whitewash as well.

The Marine Corps originally claimed that a convoy from the Camp Pendleton, Calif.-based Kilo Company, 3rd Battalion, 1st Marines, hit a roadside bomb that killed Lance Cpl. Miguel Terrazas, 20, of El Paso, Texas, and the ensuing firefight killed 15 Iraqi civilians — casualties the Corps at first claimed were killed in the bomb blast — including seven women and three children.

Why did they fail to mention that the army admitted that it wasn’t an IED atack that killed the civilains, and their own photos show the civillians having been shot at close range and execution style. Maybe because they’re biased?

But I also remember the military denying that Iraqis were being held and tortured at Abu Gharib, and conservative rushing to paint anyone who believed the MSM as ant-troop or America haters.

“Why did they fail to mention that the army admitted that it wasn’t an IED atack that killed the civilains, and their own photos show the civillians having been shot at close range and execution style. Maybe because they’re biased?”

Why did you fail to provide a link to these photos, or to a website which backs up your claims? Maybe because you’re a liar?

Dan said
“You can worship liars. I would rather bring charges.”

Well the good news is…everyone that someone like dan would vote for…..will lose and they cant do anything to anyone!!

SteveG on May 18, 2006 at 1:17 am said:

Jesus also says He came not to bring peace but a sword… Jesus is depicted as returning in the end with His robe soaked in blood.
Jesus is depicted as the leader of the warrior class of angels.
And Jesus is also all those things you mentioned.

You have to take both. Jesus isn’t always Mr.Rogers with a beard, but He is the most compassionate, kindest being… but when confronting evil against children or the poor and unfortunate, when confronting hypocrisy… Jesus is also fierce and very condemnatory… He draws on some pretty gruesome imagery to illustrate what will happen to the perpetrators.
If you want to play the Jesus card, you have to play the whole thing… not just the part you like.

You are wrong. NoWHERE Does jesus support VIolence. You are misinterpreting stuff. Soaked in blood doesnt say to go out and kill people. To have him say “do good to those that hate you”,”turn the other cheek” and then say “go kill people would be a direct contradiction making the Bible B.S.

Don’t even try with the Money changers at the temple either. He didnt hit anyone. He used the whip to scare the animals off to make everyone leave.

George Bush is not a Christian.

Also Murthaistheman is not a Christian either. Jesus did say that it was time to beat the plowshares into swords. The whole Bible is filled with war, Jesus did use vilolence against evil, like you Murthaistheman, how many innocents do Liberals murder each and every day at abortion clinics, well let me see here as of now the count is higher than all the wars put together.
NO it is the Liberals who will be seeing Satan’s wrath first.

John Murtha is a senile old reprobate shyster politician, as are most liberal politicians, and as nuts as most liberals in general. Murtha boldly accuses “Marines” of killing 15 innocent Iraqis. How come the old schmuck doesn’t point out the hundreds and thousands of innocent Iraqis that have been targeted and murdered by the terrorists? Simple, he’s got an agenda. He’s fighting the war against Bush. His statement is designed to dishonor the Marines in general (you’ll note he doesn’t say 2 or 3 combatants, he makes it sound like “all marines”). He hopes to cause rebelliousness from those where the war is being waged .. Iraq, Afghanistan, Iran, Syria etc. His efforts are aiding Iraqi insurgents, other terrorists, and fomenting anti Americanism. For liberals who pretend to care about our servicemen, supporting Murtha in his ongoing efforts and others like him shows where you really stand. I don’t care if Murtha is a decorated ex-Marine, he now is a blowhard politician suffering from some sort of liberal induced dementia.

As for liberals here who suggest that Republicans are blood thirsty, where the hell were you caring liberals during the Clinton administration’s “war” in Kosovo where innocent people were accidentally or purposely killed by our airmen’s bombing sorties. I don’t remember Murtha accusing airman of murder, or taking to task Clinton’s war.

What this proves to me is that Murtha will sell out his country because of his irrational and unbridled hate for Republicans (if Bush were a Democrat this war would be a just and good one) but mostly because of his sick need for political power, fame, and money (kinda like blood to a vampire).

Ummm lets see. Christians believe that God reveals Himself in three distinct ways.
There is a sort of relationship between them that seems like family and it is portrayed that way.
Father
Son
Spirit

God is Father, King etc. Jesus is Lord.
Lord Almighty… the more correct translation of Lord Almighty is the leader of angel armies. Look it up.
When the egyptians were swarming after their fleeing slaves the Jews, the Jews fled to the edge of the Red Sea and the Lord opened up the sea and let the children of Israel pass and released the flood upon the pursuing Egyptians… and they stood in awe and proclaimed the Lord is a warrior. That is Jesus… way before the virgin birth thing. As captain of the angel army, who sent the angels to kill all the egyptian first born?

When Jesus did come into the story in human form, He is portrayed as a peacemaker and goes to great pains to tell the world he is here to start a revolution… but not one of those…. it is a revolution of the heart and isn’t at all militaristic. But He remains fierce in the face of hypocrisy and oppression and uses very violent and descriptive language in detailling the coming fate… we see references to scriptures that show man running to the rocks and those rocks will be melting and he’ll run to the sea and the sea will be boiling and told it would be better for that man to put a chain around and cast himself into the sea….
Thats a sorta hard way to go and not much cheek turning going on there.
You a free to worship Mr. Rogers with a beard and I believe that as a caricature of christian masculinity Mr. Rogers certainly was a good man, but that kind of man comes nowhere near to describing a diety that describes Himself as walking through the clouds, knowing the stars by name, who has zero problem with our responsibilities for evil.
People die, get wiped out, destroyed, humbled. If they learn from it they get restored.

Blessed are the peacemakers… you know… the ones that come after war.
That’ll piss some people off, but battle and warfare appear in nearly every page of the Bible. Context is important, but I can’t see reading the whole thing and coming to the conclusion that it is all about peace on earth. The ending alone is so full of awful imagery that it’s scary…

That said, I don’t know what God thinks of all this, so how about we knock off with the pious “i know more than you about who Jesus really is and what he’d do here” it lacks humility and credibility.

John Murtha stopped being a “Marine” a long damn time ago!

Example: Marines don’t hang with fucking scumbags like these!

http://www.codepink4peace.org/img/original/Home_murtha_flowers.gif

Whatsmore, Code Pink has not only called our military men and women outright murderers, but it has a long history of aiding and abetting our enemies too.

From its founder Medusa Benjamin flying a surgeon to Nicaragua to operate on the hand of a commie terrorist who had killed 5 Marines in the 80’s, to its latest POS member Cindy Sheehan probably hustling down to Caracas to probably beg her new friend Hugo to bang her fugly ass.

Bottom line: I wouldn’t piss on a member of Code Pink if they were on fire.

And I don’t know many peoiple who would either.

So your leftists want to kill the troops to save them huh?

MY LAI MY LAI MY LAI

The real question is what his point of bringing this up? It’s not like he was lamenting that war brutalizes all involved, he was finger pointing at our side alone, and that is the point of the reaction to his statements. The other side kills scores of innocents daily, by plan and with no apology, but I have yet to hear him say one word about that. He is only interested in what he perceives as our mistakened policies, and has nothing to say concerning the policies of the opposition. We are just wrong and that is his only point. He could be using his position to tell the world what was wrong about the opposition, and pointing out the horror of their modus operandi, but he chooses to expound upon our few failures. His is not a generalized lament, it’s an accusation and condemnation of one side only. He’s a representative all right:BDS.

Liberals have no end to their rights and no beginning to their responsibilities.

Way to go Murtha, dont you at least want the official report before you condemn the troops? How many of our soldiers are going to be killed because you said this, and then we find out its bullshit? Time to shuffle off to the elderly home, jackass.

No wonder we can never again trust the libs with national security, they just cant rid themselves of their Vietnam-era troop hating bias. Even the veterans are doing it now.

Liberal maroons.

Where is the proof for this massacre? It doesn’t exist. If it did, it would be trumpeted across the globe by our intrepid media (a la Abu Ghraib), rather than spoken out of the fever swamps of the far-out-left. ‘Dan’ has no proof that this atrocity happened. He just read it on Kos, or heard it from Mad Murtha, and therefore it ‘must’ be true. So he and his kind will always be the first to believe that anything said against our troops must be true.

I bet Dan still even thinks he is a patriot. Scum.

Scofield on May 17, 2006 at 10:31 pm said:

Edited

Can’t someone make this imbecilic moron SHUT UP?

Jack “Mai Lai” Murtha does it again…

Ian from Expose the Left has the video and transcript of Jack Murtha comparing the incident at Haditha, Iraq to the Mai Lai massacre.

CHRIS MATTHEWS, HOST: Let me ask you Mr. Murtha to give us some details about that. Draw us a picture of what h…

Frank said @ 10:44PM “Republican Tim Russert said his sources in the pentagon have told him that Murtha is right and is speaking for the troops.”

Yo Frank! Tim is a good, card-carrying democrat. He served a Chief of Staff to Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan from 1977 to 1982. Afterwards, he served a legal counsel to New York Governor Mario Cuomo. Please engage your brain, he is not a republican.

Would those be the famous ‘anonymous’ sources?

Libs are funny the way they lap-up anything from those unnamed sources.

Where’s the story or the proof that civilians were killed?

Oh,...

“Judicial evidence is an archaic bourgeois detail.”—Che Guevara

Yep, Marxists are jackasses. For all those on this thread, gracias for identifying yourselves

During the Kosovo “War” an army sergeant kidnapped, raped and murdered an 11 year old school girl. Locals followed a trail of blood into a school where they found her body.

It does not mean that Clinton ordered the killings, it means an American committed a crime. Do not blame the entire Army or marine corp Murtha has been a congressman for 30 years. He has screwed the taxpayer by getting point for reserve duty, and now will collect two pensions from the government. The people in the Pentagon have little respect for him. He has been taking isolated incidents of criminal activity and using them for personal political gain. HE is a sick, elderly man. Other marines turned in the ones who did wrong. BY calling all marines cold blooded murderers, he is a traitor. It is like calling all democratic congressmen drug addicts/drunk drivers because of the Kennedy’s, or all hispanics gang members because 300,000 illegals are in prison. Shame on those who so easily will condemn the good people of the military. Shame on Chris Matthews.

Murtha: Marines killed Iraqis ‘in cold blood’...

This has gotten quite a few people talking this morning.

Rep. John Murtha, an influential Pennsylvania lawmaker and outspoken critic of the war in Iraq, said today Marines had “killed innocent civilians in cold blood” after allegedly responding …

it’s a fact…the US Army is much better at killing (accidentally or otherwise) Iraqi civilians than Saddam Hussein. More Iraqis die on a daily basis under US occupation than did during Saddam’s reign.

iraqbodycount.org

Until you have actually served in Iraq and see the wonderful job our soldiers do everyday and the results of them not fighting back. Just try one time trying to piece back together a young soldier after an IED explosion or the innocent iraqis killed by that same IED explosion. Until you have been there and seen it yourself, shut your hole, you know nothing about what you speak.

Considering all the reports over the last eight months that have come out saying Karl Rove is absolutely, positiviely, with 110 percent certainty going to be indicted in the next few days—he was indicted this past Monday, wasn’t he?—I’d be a little wary of going out on a limb claiming you know absolutely, positiviely, with 110 percent certainty that a report about a report that alleges the current U.S. military is chock full of little William Calleys is accurate.

Ill give you all a Murtha Story. My cousin was in mid semester at college. She was called into duty and had to leave 1 week before finals.

She offered to take the finals early so that she could complete her coursework as opposed to losing a whole semester.

One of the schools professors would not let her. She called her representative, Murtha, for help on the situation. His office basically told her to F-off. This was a state funded College.

Support the troops my ass.

[...] Expose the Left has the video of Rep. Murtha’s condemnation of the US Marines. [...]

What it comes down to is this. . .

This is just another reason for the Chemcanocrats to complain because they are not in power. They will turn anything into an opportunity to be able to do and/or say whatever to regain control. This outright GUILTY CHARGE BEFORE FACTS talk is just another type of complaint because the Chemcanocrats are not in power. I am not saying anything either way because I do not have facts to base a decision on but what I am saying is Martha has already made his decision. It is still under investigation but Martha has completed his without justification – only hearsay (by the way, hearsay is inadmissable in court).

More Examples:

The immigration rally in Washington with Ted Kennedy speaking.

Wellstone’s death in 2002 and Daschle talking about “winning this election for Wellstone”. (point is – death = political opportunity).

Coretta Scott King Funeral and Clinton speaking. – http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/data/2006/02/08/20060208_162400_flash8.htm

9/11 and how Bush “knew it was going to happen”.

The BULLSHIT conspiracy theories about Bush blowing the places up. (Now that’s grasping if you ask me.)

Rove. . . Abramoff. . . (even with some validity – the point is still a political opportunity)

The list could go on and on but my only point is anything to regain control. . .

John Murtha should be censured. How come we don’t hear from Russ Foolsgold on this one. C’mon you Democrapic lib maroons…....say something you accusatory, fingerpointing, wimp-ass, limp-wristed, pantie-waists…...speak up…....oh! yeah…...free speech without regard for content, evidence or the accused….sounds like Duke University, also.

Being ex-USN, I can only imagine any Marines’ reaction to this Alzheimer-afflicted Congressman.

Murtha is a disgrace to all veterans, let alone representing Pennsylvania. Shame on you Repr. Murtha.

I just want to recognize for a moment here the news of our Canadian brothers/sisters in arms and the loss of Captain Nichola Goddard in Afghanistan.

Booyah! AMF

[...] Also blogging: Blue Star Chronicles, Blue Crab Boulevard, Flopping Aces, Gateway Pundit, Expose the Left [...]

just for the record. . .

In post # 80. . .

“Martha” IS intentional.

docmoen on May 18, 2006 at 8:59 am said:

Until you have actually served in Iraq and see the wonderful job our soldiers do everyday and the results of them not fighting back. Just try one time trying to piece back together a young soldier after an IED explosion or the innocent iraqis killed by that same IED explosion. Until you have been there and seen it yourself, shut your hole, you know nothing about what you speak.

You’re right Doc. Invading a country and killing 30,000+ innocent civilians is entirely justified

Your compassion is overwhelming.

it’s a fact…the US Army is much better at killing (accidentally or otherwise) Iraqi civilians than Saddam Hussein. More Iraqis die on a daily basis under US occupation than did during Saddam’s reign.

The key word being “accidentally”.

The other key words are “under occupation”; its not the U.S. soldiers doing the killing, its the victims muslim brethren who ignite the car bombs.

Now I know we could get into an existential argument about why we are in Iraq, but that would detract from the fact that people like you ALWAYS drag out the “it was better then” argument.

“Sure Saddam was a murderous psychopath, but he had the trains running on time!”

Its the same arguement used since time immemorial to justify the failure to remove savages such as Hitler, Pol Pot, Stalin, Castro and Hussein.

And Im supposed to trust the liberals with the defense of this country. BWWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

You’re right Doc. Invading a country and killing 30,000+ innocent civilians is entirely justified

What a yutz. If the U.S military really meant to slaughter civilians, there arent enough bulldozers in the entire world to dig the mass graves fast enough.

As if Marines are driving truck bombs into Iraqi marketplaces.

You are foolish beyond all comprehension. Where was your compassion for the last thirty years of Hussein’s rule? Im sure the fate of Iraqi civilians was number one on your plate. Yeah.

Go to Murtha’s website

Use 05901 as the zip-code

Tell this Bozo what you think of his grandstanding against Marines/servicemen-women.

Booyah! AMF

Here’s Murthas site:

http://www.house.gov/murtha/contact.shtml

You’re right Doc. Invading a country and killing 30,000+ innocent civilians is entirely justified

I thought it was the terrorists, oh excuse me “insurgents”, killing the innocent civilians, with their road side bombs and their suicide bomb runs, but apparently i was mistaken thank you for enlightening me.

This is the same bs you hear over and over, no one can take personal responsibility for their actions or blame some else. Do you really think terrorists wouldnt be killing people if we never went into iraq, well they may not kill them there but they sure as hell would be killing them somewhere.
To reiterate, innocents are dying because of the roadside bombs planted by TERRORISTS, not the US armed forces. Although I guess the US is guilty because they didn’t kill the terrorist who planted the bomb there in the first place before he could plant it there. Good logic, no wonder the libs are not in power.

Both Democrats, and Republicans found a way to keep the oil flowing from Iraq regardless what Saddam was doing.

What amazes me is the utter denial of some of the posters here. Murtha could make one phone call and find out what happened. I heard about this “incident” on Air America. The only place you can find out what is “really” going on in our government.

I listen to the Rightie talkers, but they lie so much it makes me sick to my stomach. All you have to do is listen to both sides, the righties, and the lefties, and you can pretty much figure out what is really going on in our country.

The problem is if all of you listened to Schultz, Franken, Hartman, Miller, or the rest for 2 weeks you may get a clue as to what is really going on in America. You haven’t got the courgae to hear someone telling you why your whole ideology is based on lies, and distortions. Your head would explode.

The great thing about Progressive Talk Radio is they point out the lies of the Righties on a daily basis. I never hear any of the Righties pointing out the lies of the lefty talkers.

It is because leftie talkers don’t have to lie.

Oh by the way here is a clue as to how well we are doing in Iraq.

World Opionon of US Sinking

http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/frontpage/index.ssf?/base/news-5/114784645160150.xml

Way to go Bush. Making the world think we are their enemy.

the leftists would have been happier if saddam and sons were still in charge to torture and murder hundred of thousands of more Iraqis for decades to come. their idea of moral high ground is to cry outrage at atrocities around the world, if they even notice them, but otherwise not support any effort to bring them to an end. like a guy telling someone to stop raping and murduring his wife, without actually trying to stop him. they are not just ignorant, they are just as evil as the perp.

By the way everyone know it is not our troops doing the killing. Just remember what Powell told Bush. “You own it”.

Since we did not have a plan to deal with 99% of what happened after the invasion, and could not provide security, EVERY DEATH IN IRAQ IS OUR FAULT. Noone is saying Saddam would not have tortured or killed anyone if we didn’t invade, but we did invade, and did not devote the resources, or enlist enough allies to provide proper security (or electricity).

Every death in Iraq is 100% our fault. The president represents you, and he decided to go to war the day he was elected it appears. This makes 30,000 to 250,000 dead Iraqis YOUR FAULT. You voted for this liar, deserter, and traitor.

Yes tratitor. He had his staff attack the CIA and destroy Brewster Jennings. This is TREASON.

Mr. Murtha keep telling the truth. Maybe if the American People understand all the horrors of war (which Bush tries to keep sanitary, no coffin pictures etc.) powermad people like Bush would be less likely to wage it for political capitol in the future.

Murtha has jumped to conclusions before the facts of the investigation have been presented. I called his office at phone# 202-225-2065 and did talk to a person to express my opinion of his kangaroo court sense of justice. Diana Irey is running against this “good ole boy” (Murtha) who’s been in D.C. 32 years. I just gave some $ to her (Diana Irey’s) campaign. Thanks to you Ian and “Flopping Aces”! God bless our troops and their families

Dan @ 91

Just got a phone call from your village and they want you back.

#92 Shuckey why pick on Saddam? People are being murdered by their government in China. Why don’t we invade China? Oh I forgot. Noone else would be able to sell us cheap crap so the top 1# can make a buck! Noone would loan us money to pay for our wars either.

96 the left claims to champion the suffering people of the world. it is really a crock, all they care is their own selfish effort to get something from the guy next door who has more than he does. even socialists in the west would not want global socialism because everyone in developed countries would suffer, even the poorest of the poor in the west. it’s a bag of hypocrite shit.

for once we liberate millions of people from genocidal tyrrany, and all the leftists care about is how they can steal their piece of the pie.

communism, failure as it was, is alive and well in the loony left.

if sharia comes, i will grow a beard, get a prayer rug, and laugh at all the crying, dying leftist jackasses who brought it on themselves.

Find me one good piece of evidence that supports your claim that our soldiers have killed 30,000 innocent civilians, laughable.

Murtha always appears to be constipated…

#97 Did I say I supported Communism? Don’t paint me with the brush Rush, and Rove would like me painted with.

Do you think a democracy that is corrupt from top to bottom is effective government? Where the top 1% makes so much money that when adjusted for inflation they make up for the fact that the other 99% of us are losing ground?

We have a fascist government in the guise of a democracy. Electronic voting machine companies largely control the vote counting, large corporations control most of the media, and donations from the same large companies finance our political system. Who gets to run for office depends on how much money they can raise, and nothng else.

All pointed to an American Oligarcy.

Deal with it.

End it.

Public financing of all elections!

No more Duke Cunninghams!

Like listening to the Sunni Association of Muslim Terrorists, all I can think when I hear something from Murtha is “You’re dead to me.”

Dan you are a commie.

You dance when soldiers die. You consider 9/11 to be the happiest day of your life.

YOu hate this country so much PLEASE LEAVE!

GO to China or Cuba where communist worthless subhuman trash like you belong.

Thank you though for proving liberals love terrorism.

Who’s your biggest hero since you love genocide so much?

Hitler, Bin Laden or Saddam?

DEMOCRATS LOVE THE ACLU. THE ACLU LOVES NAMBLA AND AL QUEDA. THAT SAYS IT ALL.

Only good thing about Dan being here is his victims are spared the molestations.

He is a liberal which means he supports NAMBLA which means he loves child rape.

What’s Murtha, an ex-marine?

How appropriate.

Oh, finally, Dan reveals the source for his story – Air America Radio, the most dishonest, most partisan and anti-American media outlet in the entire country.

Maybe next time, Dan can link us to a Westboro Baptist Church press release to provide us with ‘true’ information.

docmoen on May 18, 2006 at 11:29 am said:

Find me one good piece of evidence that supports your claim that our soldiers have killed 30,000 innocent civilians, laughable.

iraqbodycount.org

read it and weep. no…really. weep, if you have the capacity.